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hurting God? - 5/7/2010 10:22:29 PM
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tania_lizzeth
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I heard a preacher say that we hurt Gods heart when we sin. So we need to love him enough so that we avoid sinning because his heart aches... Is this true?!?!
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RE: hurting God? - 5/8/2010 12:26:01 PM
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Logik
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I would imagine it is a metaphor. I've never really imagined God as having a heart, and of course our own heart does not hurt when someone else does wrong unto us (with the exception of physical damage to the heart itself, or a stress-induced heart attack, etc).
I do not think you hurt God when you sin.
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RE: hurting God? - 5/8/2010 4:22:06 PM
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rawr.ben
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I don't think God's emotional well-being is dependent upon how perfect we are.
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RE: hurting God? - 5/8/2010 6:08:37 PM
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idlenomore
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When we have a relationship with God I imagine it must at least bother Him when we sin, otherwise why all the fuss?
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RE: hurting God? - 5/13/2010 5:42:44 PM
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Eutychus
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A verse to consider is Ephesians 4:30
"Do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, by whom you were sealed for the day of redemption."
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RE: hurting God? - 5/13/2010 8:17:12 PM
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drmark
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Eutychus
A verse to consider is Ephesians 4:30
"Do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, by whom you were sealed for the day of redemption."
Amen, Euthychus! The Bible is jam packed with references to God's distress over mankind's sinfulness. Anyone who denies this is flirting with antinomianism.
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RE: hurting God? - 5/20/2010 10:51:01 PM
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rgod
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I was just listening to a song about this the other day - "so in love" by Donnie McClurkin. Yes, there are many scriptures about the Lord being grieved when we sin - you've heard some here. You might want to take a look at Jesus - who, as it says in Colossians, is the exact representation of God (because He is God). He displayed the full range of emotions concerning sin. We also see His mercy concerning sin as well.
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RE: hurting God? - 5/21/2010 11:11:44 AM
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abraxas
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If there is a God who has a perfect fore-knowledge of our actions, the question really is, Has it always hurt God when we sinned, even before there was anything but God?
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RE: hurting God? - 5/22/2010 6:45:34 AM
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wolfvanzandt
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I would think, Abraxas, that the answer to that would be, yes. Jesus knew the pain he would have to suffer in His ministry; God knew how painful His work would be.
My work is rather painful sometimes - especially when I see clients doing things that I know will backfire on them - some rehab clients have a bad habit of shooting themselves in the foot - but it's a worth occupation.
I haven't been surprised by any of the painful parts of my occupation. My training prepared me fully.
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RE: hurting God? - 5/22/2010 3:49:58 PM
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abraxas
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wolfvanzandt, it sounds like you're in some kind of therapy/counseling field, and I agree it's a worthwhile occupation, and not an easy one! You've chosen to enter into a scenario you had no part in creating, knowing it would be painful and trying. In God's case, I don't know why one would be concerned if anything in this life hurts him or not--he created it all the way he did and knew precisely how it would play out, so he must have been okay with it.
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RE: hurting God? - 5/22/2010 8:49:58 PM
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smiley7
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Hi tania
Yes it's true and there are plenty of scriptures to back it up.
To me it's almost common sense but here's an example.
You are in a close, intimate relationship with someone and they do something that hurts themselves, you or someone you love either directly or indirectly. How would you feel?
I know we are not God but we were created for relationships, especially with Him and that's why we repent/are sorry. We no longer have to kill the fatted lamb as a sacrifice but we are still directed to repentance so again common sense kicks in here.
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RE: hurting God? - 6/13/2010 3:53:58 PM
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gralan
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quote:
ORIGINAL: abraxas
...In God's case, I don't know why one would be concerned if anything in this life hurts him or not--he created it all the way he did and knew precisely how it would play out, so he must have been okay with it.
I've read responses to this theme in other threads and on other forums that has amazed me at times. I'm almost positive most of those folks couldn't really mean exactingly everything they stated so strongly.
In another manner of speaking, they state that God made His bed so He gets to lay in it. When humans talk that way about other humans it is definately a judgmental criticism.
Any personal characteristics we humans possess are put into our nature by our Creatior, who by necessity has to have those personal qualities to transmit them. God is relational within God; and since creation God has relationship with all God created.
It is one thing to say that someone can take abuse.
It is another to say its okay to abuse someone.
Of course, what do I know - working as a Psychological Technician for the state Department of Health ina 24/7 long-term treatment facility as well as being a shift supervisor and an instructor, doesn't qualify me to do much.
But I'd like to think I've learned some things. 
If I were to verbally assault and insult another person, it may not damage them at all (its logically possible) but my actions display more about me and my problems.
We are told to walk humbly with God. This is very plain Biblical truth. It should prove difficult to remain humble and callously abusive at the same time.
This is what God still wants from us: do justice, love mercy, walk humbly with your God. Micah 6.8
Peace in Christ to you.
Out! 
< Message edited by gralan -- 6/13/2010 4:01:35 PM >
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RE: hurting God? - 6/13/2010 4:47:42 PM
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SovereignIsHe
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I think it's more a case of Anthropomorphism, attributing human characteristics to God so that man can understand then God actually having emotions and all that follows that...
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Proverbs 12:10 A righteous man regardeth the life of his beast: but the tender mercies of the wicked are cruel.
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RE: hurting God? - 6/13/2010 4:52:17 PM
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drmark
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quote:
I'm almost positive most of those folks couldn't really mean exactingly everything they stated so strongly. I suspect most agno-atheists mean exactly what they say regarding their flippant responses about God...
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Jeremiah 31:31-34. The time is NOW, fellow saints!
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RE: hurting God? - 6/13/2010 6:39:30 PM
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Intrepidus
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quote:
ORIGINAL: SovereignIsHe
I think it's more a case of Anthropomorphism, attributing human characteristics to God so that man can understand then God actually having emotions and all that follows that...
I agree. God cannot be harmed in any way by His creatures. This is what the doctrine of Impassibility states. It's not that God is emotionless or apathetic. Rather, that He is "not subject to suffering, pain, or the ebb and flow of involuntary passions." In his article God Without Mood Swings, Phillip Johnson writes:
God isn't like a stone or an iceberg. His immutability is not inertia. The fact that He doesn't change His mind certainly doesn't mean He is devoid of thought. Likewise, the fact that He isn't subject to involuntary passions doesn't mean He is devoid of true affections. What it does mean is that God's mind and God's affections are not like human thoughts and passions. There's never anything involuntary, irrational, or out of control about the divine affections.
That pretty much sums-up my position.
-Intrepidus
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RE: hurting God? - 6/14/2010 12:49:27 AM
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gralan
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I find it interesting that folks actually clearly argue in support of people being callously abusive, especially in regards to God with whom we are told to walk humbly. That is fundamentally so skewed I am at a loss for words.
Good luck with that.
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RE: hurting God? - 6/15/2010 10:31:44 AM
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abraxas
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I get a bit lost on the last few posts of this thread, not sure who's being addressed, but to an earlier post--yes that seems right, gralan, God made this bed so he can sleep in it. According to Biblical mythology, God created the world, then two humans--then he created a tree and told them NOT to eat the fruit, even though he knew they would, and that that would open the floodgates of all the bad things going on in the world. He KNEW before he even put the humans and the tree in there. So I don't know why anyone would feel pity for God for the woes of the world, or feel guilty that they aren't perfect. According the story it's part of the plan.
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RE: hurting God? - 6/17/2010 11:59:06 AM
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DaveW
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quote:
ORIGINAL: drmark
Amen, Euthychus! The Bible is jam packed with references to God's distress over mankind's sinfulness. Anyone who denies this is flirting with antinomianism.
Antinomianism? (against the Nomos/Law?)
I would put that as flirting with gnosticism - saying that anything of the flesh including emotions is not spiritual and therefore bad.
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RE: hurting God? - 6/17/2010 12:05:40 PM
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DaveW
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quote:
ORIGINAL: SovereignIsHe
I think it's more a case of Anthropomorphism, attributing human characteristics to God so that man can understand then God actually having emotions and all that follows that... Actually it is the other way around - God made man in His own image. We have emotions ONLY because He had them before us.
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RE: hurting God? - 6/17/2010 12:10:02 PM
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DaveW
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Intrepidus
God cannot be harmed in any way by His creatures. This is what the doctrine of Impassibility states. It's not that God is emotionless or apathetic. Rather, that He is "not subject to suffering, pain, or the ebb and flow of involuntary passions." In his article God Without Mood Swings, Phillip Johnson writes:
God isn't like a stone or an iceberg. His immutability is not inertia. The fact that He doesn't change His mind certainly doesn't mean He is devoid of thought. Likewise, the fact that He isn't subject to involuntary passions doesn't mean He is devoid of true affections. What it does mean is that God's mind and God's affections are not like human thoughts and passions. There's never anything involuntary, irrational, or out of control about the divine affections.
I seriously disagree. There are too many scriptures that say God's wrath can be kindled up to just write it off as myth.
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RE: hurting God? - 6/17/2010 4:26:50 PM
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drmark
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quote:
I would put that as flirting with gnosticism Sure Dave, gnostics flirt with antinomianism all the time. That's one of their pet projects - sin as much as you like with your body because your spirit is forgiven and that's all that really matters. But there are lots of antinomians who know nothing of gnosticism and prefer to base their sinfulness on OSAS or other feeble theologies.
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Jeremiah 31:31-34. The time is NOW, fellow saints!
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RE: hurting God? - 6/17/2010 4:42:59 PM
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Eutychus
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quote:
ORIGINAL: drmark
quote:
I would put that as flirting with gnosticism Sure Dave, gnostics flirt with antinomianism all the time. That's one of their pet projects - sin as much as you like with your body because your spirit is forgiven and that's all that really matters. But there are lots of antinomians who know nothing of gnosticism and prefer to base their sinfulness on OSAS or other feeble theologies.
DrMark, I have never heard a single Baptist preacher, teacher, or lay person ever assert or even kid about a Christian being able to sin freely due being saved. Never. Usually such nonsense come from non-Baptists.
What I have heard from Baptist preachers, teachers, and lay people is that anyone sinning freely and saying, shucks, they can get forgiven after they've had their fun are fools and are proving that they aren't saved.
_____________________________
Jesus answered and said to them, "This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He has sent." -John 6:29
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RE: hurting God? - 6/17/2010 4:58:21 PM
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drmark
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I'm sorry, what does Baptist theology have to do with gnosticism or antinomianism?
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Jeremiah 31:31-34. The time is NOW, fellow saints!
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RE: hurting God? - 6/17/2010 5:28:01 PM
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Eutychus
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quote:
ORIGINAL: drmark
I'm sorry, what does Baptist theology have to do with gnosticism or antinomianism?
quote:
prefer to base their sinfulness on OSAS or other feeble theologies.
_____________________________
Jesus answered and said to them, "This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He has sent." -John 6:29
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YES; It hurts God when we sin.
